Slava Ukraini
Pages: 12
Mar 8, 2022 at 7:51pm
Last edited on Mar 8, 2022 at 8:52pm
Mar 18, 2022 at 5:41pm
The war is depressing me because I believe it is a signal that the end of liberal democracy is close.
Here is how I understand the progression of government. A democracy eventually embraces nationalism. The nationalist eventually end liberal democracy and replace it with an autocrat or a plutocracy. The new ruler/rulers usually are very good at improving their subjects lives, that is most people become wealthier in the short run.
So the ruler or rulers becomes stable. Suppressing opposition becomes easier at some point due to less and less opposition. Why oppose an autocrat who is making your life better?
When the autocrats rule is stable their subjects standard of living decreases.
In the US, Turkey, UK, and India I believe nationalism is already being embraced, and it is just a matter of time before a autocrat or plutocracy takes over.
I don’t think it can be stopped because in the beginning it looks so good.
Some countries can keep a liberal democracy for a very long time, and others like Russia didn’t even get 20 years before they became nationalist. Everyone I know says it can’t happen, but it always does. Even Rome was a democracy at one time.
Here is how I understand the progression of government. A democracy eventually embraces nationalism. The nationalist eventually end liberal democracy and replace it with an autocrat or a plutocracy. The new ruler/rulers usually are very good at improving their subjects lives, that is most people become wealthier in the short run.
So the ruler or rulers becomes stable. Suppressing opposition becomes easier at some point due to less and less opposition. Why oppose an autocrat who is making your life better?
When the autocrats rule is stable their subjects standard of living decreases.
In the US, Turkey, UK, and India I believe nationalism is already being embraced, and it is just a matter of time before a autocrat or plutocracy takes over.
I don’t think it can be stopped because in the beginning it looks so good.
Some countries can keep a liberal democracy for a very long time, and others like Russia didn’t even get 20 years before they became nationalist. Everyone I know says it can’t happen, but it always does. Even Rome was a democracy at one time.
Apr 27, 2022 at 7:31pm| robertb wrote: |
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| Here is how I understand the progression of government. A democracy eventually embraces nationalism. The nationalist eventually end liberal democracy and replace it with an autocrat or a plutocracy. The new ruler/rulers usually are very good at improving their subjects lives, that is most people become wealthier in the short run. |
That's basically it, although I'd disagree that people become wealthier. A select few usually become wealthier, and it's almost always because they are part of what's known as the ruling class.
| Suppressing opposition becomes easier at some point due to less and less opposition. Why oppose an autocrat who is making your life better? |
Suppressing opposition definitely becomes easier, but I think it's usually more due to the people's fear of retaliation; or often they will be essentially brainwashed into thinking whatever the government wants them to think.
The US has kept its democracy for an extraordinarily long time, but the government is sadly degenerating into corruption, and it's slowly turning into an oligarchy where a select few rule, with the help of the mainstream media, as well as brainwashed people who are convinced that crushing the opposition to the ruling class is good.
Apr 28, 2022 at 7:33am
Of course none of that accounts for the russian clown sitting at his long table while he murders innocent people.
Apr 28, 2022 at 9:17am
Putin isn't a clown. A clown is supposed to be funny - someone to laugh at - and no one is laughing at Putin.
Apr 28, 2022 at 9:52am
There are lots of ways to laugh at clowns.
putin is definitely a clown - absurd furniture rejects from the long-gone czars - the joke is on him.
Just like the chinese clown sitting in front of his wall hangings depicting the Great Wall pile of gravel - all built by slave labour. The jokes on him too.
We should laugh more - the sheep in china and russia don't.
Glory to Ukraine
putin is definitely a clown - absurd furniture rejects from the long-gone czars - the joke is on him.
Just like the chinese clown sitting in front of his wall hangings depicting the Great Wall pile of gravel - all built by slave labour. The jokes on him too.
We should laugh more - the sheep in china and russia don't.
Glory to Ukraine
May 1, 2022 at 4:39am| I hope I'll get up one day and read the news "Putin is dead" and the government parliament were dissolved. |
But when the inevitable occurs and the trash is collected:
| Do not rejoice in his defeat, you men. For though the world has stood up and stopped the bastard, the bitch that bore him is in heat again.“ — Bertolt Brecht |
May 1, 2022 at 8:49am
Really, you want to wake up one day to the news "<someone/anyone> is dead"? Isn't there enough premature death and suffering in this world?
May 3, 2022 at 6:00am| Really, you want to wake up one day to the news "<someone/anyone> is dead"? |
| Isn't there enough premature death and suffering in this world? |
Glory to Ukraine
May 3, 2022 at 8:55am
OK. Who's your target for Yemen - we'll hope for an early demise there too instead of bleating platitudes.
May 3, 2022 at 9:35am
I don't. Maybe one should be equally angry at all wars.
It's useful to step back and think where did the outrage come from. It's not been the longest running war, nor the most violent, so why? And so possibly gain additional perspective if there are answers to these.
It's useful to step back and think where did the outrage come from. It's not been the longest running war, nor the most violent, so why? And so possibly gain additional perspective if there are answers to these.
Last edited on May 3, 2022 at 9:46am
May 3, 2022 at 10:43am
@kbw war should be abolished. The damage is generational. Both sides will still be dealing with the emotional damage 100 years from now. In the US we are still dealing with the damage done during the Civil War.
That said, I think it is important to note that Russian propaganda is pushing: "don't look here, there's worst things happening".
I'm not accusing you of pushing propaganda. I'm asking the rhetorical question, have you been influenced by it?
That said, I think it is important to note that Russian propaganda is pushing: "don't look here, there's worst things happening".
I'm not accusing you of pushing propaganda. I'm asking the rhetorical question, have you been influenced by it?
May 3, 2022 at 11:16am| Maybe one (sic) should be equally angry at all wars. |
May 3, 2022 at 1:03pm
In the US we are still dealing with the damage done during the Civil War.
That was with primitive equipment, and there are still environmental scars. You can fly a drone up in the forest and find where their camps were by the shift in the terrain, its still obvious in many places where it was cleared for firewood, fortifications, etc ... A metal detector friend showed this to me on how he picks his sites and it was rather interesting.
Modern war leaves even more .. unexploded ordinance, wrecked vehicles/buildings/etc, explosion scars, ... whatever else.
Why the outrage? Fear. Russia is powerful enough that if it starts taking by force, what is to be done to stop that, and when? Yemen is a civil war: whatever happens, its not a war of conquest against neighbors. There is a red flag when a country annexes another by force that causes a worldwide fear and associated responses.
You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come.
That was with primitive equipment, and there are still environmental scars. You can fly a drone up in the forest and find where their camps were by the shift in the terrain, its still obvious in many places where it was cleared for firewood, fortifications, etc ... A metal detector friend showed this to me on how he picks his sites and it was rather interesting.
Modern war leaves even more .. unexploded ordinance, wrecked vehicles/buildings/etc, explosion scars, ... whatever else.
Why the outrage? Fear. Russia is powerful enough that if it starts taking by force, what is to be done to stop that, and when? Yemen is a civil war: whatever happens, its not a war of conquest against neighbors. There is a red flag when a country annexes another by force that causes a worldwide fear and associated responses.
You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. Such things must happen, but the end is still to come.
May 4, 2022 at 5:29am
Outrageous!. A small but important point. I fear it's 'ordnance' not 'ordinance'.
May 7, 2022 at 12:45am| Putin isn't a clown. A clown is supposed to be funny - someone to laugh at - and no one is laughing at Putin. |
Absolutely. He is a dictator, a totalitarian dictator with illusions of bringing back the old Soviet Union– which @againtry, being the kid he is, probably doesn't remember. My point is, one does not laugh at dictators. Did anyone laugh at Hitler? Stalin? Mao? Castro?
(Scratch the last one, some people are laughing at him)
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